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DeviouslyCursed
Why do Some Argue Against Skill Based MM?
28.07.2021 03:23:04
Subject: Why do Some Argue Against Skill Based MM?
Link on message: #12885620
LT_Moon, on Jul 27 2021 - 16:17, said: Measuring skills is one of the trickiest things in the human world.
How will you define the skill in WoT? Which indicators will you
use? Where is the evidence that the indicators you picked are
indeed valid indicators of "skills"? Also, human performance is
dynamic, which requires a long-term measure. Then how long do you
need to observe a player's performance? "Skills" assume individual
differences. Then for a game company, will they want to keep only
elite players, which are a necessarily minority? If the game puts
players in different skill tiers, will players in lower skill tiers
stay in the game? It is easy to say to have a skill-based MM
but almost impossible to make it work. Also, the game company needs
to keep a larger player base. That's my answer from a bit
academic point of view. Practically, limiting access to
higher-tier games based on the number of games played would be
better. The game cannot punish players with lower skills even
after playing the game for a while. But, requiring some experience
in lower-level games will populate the lower-tier games and prepare
players for higher-tier games. I believe very few would oppose to
the concept of skilled MM itself but to how it can be done.
Mojo_Riesing, on Jul 27 2021 - 16:44, said: Sure, i see what you are saying. Ok fine, prevent by
artificial means "lower skill" players from contaminating the
"higher skill" Tiers (not that this was ever prevented at all, but
for sake of argument let's say it was). To my mind, that
right there IS a form of "skill based" match-making, at least for
those unspecified higher Tiers. I don't know how you
compensate all the players who spent real world cash to play at
those soon to be exclusive levels but set that aside for the
moment. I'll tell you right now if they "exclusionary" zone
starts at Tier VIII you will see severe problems for Wargaming even
litigation. So, say your idea would work and if
so, just to keep it even, EXCLUDE the "higher skill" players
from any lower Tier play. I have a feeling that would be just
as unpopular and both unworkable and litigious as your suggestion
(made by others as well) but what the heck what's another
unworkable concept added to an equally unworkable concept?
Link on message: #12885620
LT_Moon, on Jul 27 2021 - 16:17, said: Measuring skills is one of the trickiest things in the human world.
How will you define the skill in WoT? Which indicators will you
use? Where is the evidence that the indicators you picked are
indeed valid indicators of "skills"? Also, human performance is
dynamic, which requires a long-term measure. Then how long do you
need to observe a player's performance? "Skills" assume individual
differences. Then for a game company, will they want to keep only
elite players, which are a necessarily minority? If the game puts
players in different skill tiers, will players in lower skill tiers
stay in the game? It is easy to say to have a skill-based MM
but almost impossible to make it work. Also, the game company needs
to keep a larger player base. That's my answer from a bit
academic point of view. Practically, limiting access to
higher-tier games based on the number of games played would be
better. The game cannot punish players with lower skills even
after playing the game for a while. But, requiring some experience
in lower-level games will populate the lower-tier games and prepare
players for higher-tier games. I believe very few would oppose to
the concept of skilled MM itself but to how it can be done.DeviouslyCursed: Win Rate per tank is one of the most accurate statistics in
the game. Period. Tanks and tiers aren't equal, that is why when
looking at the overall Win Rate, what tanks they played to get that
Win Rate is extremely important. If you could sort out platoons,
then there would be no reason to ever consider anything
else. Limiting higher tiers to "better" players is stupid.
What happens when only 55%+ players are playing at tier 10. 50% of
them still lose. Guess what happens to their Win Rate. Yes, the
same thing will happen to all their stats. You can't have 30
players in each match doing more than their tank's HP in damage.
People making this suggestion simply aren't thinking it through. Or
are possibly incapable of it. That might seem harsh but this is
ridiculously easy to see the issues with this type of
restriction.
Mojo_Riesing, on Jul 27 2021 - 16:44, said: Sure, i see what you are saying. Ok fine, prevent by
artificial means "lower skill" players from contaminating the
"higher skill" Tiers (not that this was ever prevented at all, but
for sake of argument let's say it was). To my mind, that
right there IS a form of "skill based" match-making, at least for
those unspecified higher Tiers. I don't know how you
compensate all the players who spent real world cash to play at
those soon to be exclusive levels but set that aside for the
moment. I'll tell you right now if they "exclusionary" zone
starts at Tier VIII you will see severe problems for Wargaming even
litigation. So, say your idea would work and if
so, just to keep it even, EXCLUDE the "higher skill" players
from any lower Tier play. I have a feeling that would be just
as unpopular and both unworkable and litigious as your suggestion
(made by others as well) but what the heck what's another
unworkable concept added to an equally unworkable concept?DeviouslyCursed: Taking time and battles to reach the higher tiers is
effectively the restriction. The fact that some people can't or
won't learn is not WG's fault. Nor can they do anything about it.
At least not if the game was to be successful. As fun as EverQuest
and Ultima Online were because of their brutal difficulty and
severe punishing of mistakes, companies figured out pretty quick
you got more players if you made it so everyone could reach end
game content. And yes Mojo has it right: changing WoT to that
now isn't possible, even if it was a good idea (it's not though).
DeviouslyCursed
Is this Really Random?
28.07.2021 03:01:26
Subject: Is this Really Random?
Link on message: #12885607
Projectile_Misfired, on Jul 27 2021 - 22:34, said: The reason the results look so different is because you're
choosing your teams using different parameters/metrics.
YOU chose your teams strictly based off a player's PR. MM
choses teams based strictly off of Tank Tier and Type. It
ignores PR.
umkhulu, on Jul 27 2021 - 21:10, said: I will check the points you have raised and get back to
you!.... 
Link on message: #12885607
Projectile_Misfired, on Jul 27 2021 - 22:34, said: The reason the results look so different is because you're
choosing your teams using different parameters/metrics.
YOU chose your teams strictly based off a player's PR. MM
choses teams based strictly off of Tank Tier and Type. It
ignores PR. DeviouslyCursed: I don't think that's it. The pool of players should still be
representative of the population, so even though WoT is matching
tanks and such, the PR distribution should still be the same.
umkhulu, on Jul 27 2021 - 21:10, said: I will check the points you have raised and get back to
you!.... DeviouslyCursed: Yeah, the more I think about it, the more certain I am that
is has to be #3 of my post. WoT is pulling from a relatively smooth
distribution curve, but I'm betting your program is effectively
pulling from a set of plateaus. This will have the effect of over
representing worse players on the left side of the median for each
color, and over representing good players on the right side of the
median (assuming skill increasing from left to right). This would
most likely have the effect of showing a wider disparity of skill
than there actually is (in other words, making the distribution
graph wider). Well, after taking a look at Neato's data, I
didn't realize yours was that far away from the WoT (hey, those
numbers on the bottom mean something!), so maybe the pool of
players wouldn't account that much difference. Maybe you just
messed something up somewhere.
DeviouslyCursed
Is this Really Random?
27.07.2021 21:45:16
Subject: Is this Really Random?
Link on message: #12885375
umkhulu, on Jul 27 2021 - 18:28, said: To answer your question, I created a random team generator
against which to compare WoT's matchmaker teams. The results are
quit interesting.... The random team generator is an
algorithm which creates any number of randomly skilled opposing
teams and spits out the PR ratios for statistical evaluation. The
program simulates the proportion of players falling within each
skill bracket at Tier 8. (i.e. 5% Red, 37% Orange, 41% Yellow, 15%
Green, 2% Blue and 0.2% Purple) I have generated 4000
matches for comparison purposes, but the stats remain pretty much
the same no matter how many line-ups you simulate. 
Everything looks normal, but
it would seem that some bell curves are more normal than
others..... 
As you can see, the WoT bell curve is altogether more 'compact'
with a standard deviation of only 3, a variance of 11 as opposed
135, and a positive kurtosis indicating less outliers. So,
the question now becomes, why is MM's random so different from
mine. I'm hoping that somebody has a reasoned explanation instead
of the normal scathing and meaningless comments!....
Link on message: #12885375
umkhulu, on Jul 27 2021 - 18:28, said: To answer your question, I created a random team generator
against which to compare WoT's matchmaker teams. The results are
quit interesting.... The random team generator is an
algorithm which creates any number of randomly skilled opposing
teams and spits out the PR ratios for statistical evaluation. The
program simulates the proportion of players falling within each
skill bracket at Tier 8. (i.e. 5% Red, 37% Orange, 41% Yellow, 15%
Green, 2% Blue and 0.2% Purple) I have generated 4000
matches for comparison purposes, but the stats remain pretty much
the same no matter how many line-ups you simulate. Everything looks normal, but
it would seem that some bell curves are more normal than
others.....
As you can see, the WoT bell curve is altogether more 'compact'
with a standard deviation of only 3, a variance of 11 as opposed
135, and a positive kurtosis indicating less outliers. So,
the question now becomes, why is MM's random so different from
mine. I'm hoping that somebody has a reasoned explanation instead
of the normal scathing and meaningless comments!.... DeviouslyCursed: A couple of things. 1. Are you sure your ratio of
players is correct?2. Even if the ratios are correct, do they all
play the same amount? For instance a blue who plays twice as much
as the average# of games would should be represented twice (or
close to it, since he can't be on his own team, it's not quite
x2)3. I'm betting your random generator is assigning PR values
within the brackets randomly, when that likely is not the case. For
example, the reds are more likely to be to the higher end than the
lower end, but I'm guessing your random generator will spread them
equally across the whole range. For the actual PR numbers, all
brackets above the average have more people closer to the lower
end, all brackets under the average will have more people toward
the higher end. This would likely have an effect of pushing things
closer together for the actual WoT chart, because the skill spread
isn't as large as your random generator is producing.4. If you are
using an individual's (or a few individual's data) their own PR is
likely influencing the actual WoT chart.5. Your mode in your random
one says 37, and that's clearly not correct. I'm betting the
biggest effect is #3 above. So, if I understand your chart
correctly, you showing that the skill spread should be even higher
than what it is in WoT matches?
Elias_K_Grodin
Is this Really Random?
27.07.2021 21:42:12
Subject: Is this Really Random?
Link on message: #12885373
umkhulu, on Jul 27 2021 - 11:28, said: To answer your question, I created a random team generator
against which to compare WoT's matchmaker teams. The results are
quit interesting.... The random team generator is an
algorithm which creates any number of randomly skilled opposing
teams and spits out the PR ratios for statistical evaluation. The
program simulates the proportion of players falling within each
skill bracket at Tier 8. (i.e. 5% Red, 37% Orange, 41% Yellow, 15%
Green, 2% Blue and 0.2% Purple) I have generated 4000
matches for comparison purposes, but the stats remain pretty much
the same no matter how many line-ups you simulate. Everything looks normal, but
it would seem that some bell curves are more normal than
others.....
As you can see, the WoT bell curve is altogether more 'compact'
with a standard deviation of only 3, a variance of 11 as opposed
135, and a positive kurtosis indicating less outliers. So,
the question now becomes, why is MM's random so different from
mine. I'm hoping that somebody has a reasoned explanation instead
of the normal scathing and meaningless comments!....
Link on message: #12885373
umkhulu, on Jul 27 2021 - 11:28, said: To answer your question, I created a random team generator
against which to compare WoT's matchmaker teams. The results are
quit interesting.... The random team generator is an
algorithm which creates any number of randomly skilled opposing
teams and spits out the PR ratios for statistical evaluation. The
program simulates the proportion of players falling within each
skill bracket at Tier 8. (i.e. 5% Red, 37% Orange, 41% Yellow, 15%
Green, 2% Blue and 0.2% Purple) I have generated 4000
matches for comparison purposes, but the stats remain pretty much
the same no matter how many line-ups you simulate. Everything looks normal, but
it would seem that some bell curves are more normal than
others.....
As you can see, the WoT bell curve is altogether more 'compact'
with a standard deviation of only 3, a variance of 11 as opposed
135, and a positive kurtosis indicating less outliers. So,
the question now becomes, why is MM's random so different from
mine. I'm hoping that somebody has a reasoned explanation instead
of the normal scathing and meaningless comments!.... Elias_K_Grodin: Thank you for the nice presentation and visual
graphs! Regarding Random Battles on a whole, especially from
the perspective of a mostly Tier V-VI player, I run into Tier VIII
battles quite frequently. No I do not run XVM and just play
the vanilla client. It "might" be helpful to look and see what type
of players I am going up against, but I don't trust just stats and
want to play according to what I know about the vehicles I'm going
up against. Just my advice but worry less about the other
teams stats and more about your position, your teammates, and if
you're spotted. "Never fear your enemy but always respect
them." - John Basilone, United States Marine Corps
Hey_man_Gneis_shot
Is this Really Random?
27.07.2021 21:42:12
Subject: Is this Really Random?
Link on message: #12885373
umkhulu, on Jul 27 2021 - 11:28, said: To answer your question, I created a random team generator
against which to compare WoT's matchmaker teams. The results are
quit interesting.... The random team generator is an
algorithm which creates any number of randomly skilled opposing
teams and spits out the PR ratios for statistical evaluation. The
program simulates the proportion of players falling within each
skill bracket at Tier 8. (i.e. 5% Red, 37% Orange, 41% Yellow, 15%
Green, 2% Blue and 0.2% Purple) I have generated 4000
matches for comparison purposes, but the stats remain pretty much
the same no matter how many line-ups you simulate. Everything looks normal, but
it would seem that some bell curves are more normal than
others.....
As you can see, the WoT bell curve is altogether more 'compact'
with a standard deviation of only 3, a variance of 11 as opposed
135, and a positive kurtosis indicating less outliers. So,
the question now becomes, why is MM's random so different from
mine. I'm hoping that somebody has a reasoned explanation instead
of the normal scathing and meaningless comments!....
Link on message: #12885373
umkhulu, on Jul 27 2021 - 11:28, said: To answer your question, I created a random team generator
against which to compare WoT's matchmaker teams. The results are
quit interesting.... The random team generator is an
algorithm which creates any number of randomly skilled opposing
teams and spits out the PR ratios for statistical evaluation. The
program simulates the proportion of players falling within each
skill bracket at Tier 8. (i.e. 5% Red, 37% Orange, 41% Yellow, 15%
Green, 2% Blue and 0.2% Purple) I have generated 4000
matches for comparison purposes, but the stats remain pretty much
the same no matter how many line-ups you simulate. Everything looks normal, but
it would seem that some bell curves are more normal than
others.....
As you can see, the WoT bell curve is altogether more 'compact'
with a standard deviation of only 3, a variance of 11 as opposed
135, and a positive kurtosis indicating less outliers. So,
the question now becomes, why is MM's random so different from
mine. I'm hoping that somebody has a reasoned explanation instead
of the normal scathing and meaningless comments!.... Hey_man_Gneis_shot: Thank you for the nice presentation and visual
graphs! Regarding Random Battles on a whole, especially from
the perspective of a mostly Tier V-VI player, I run into Tier VIII
battles quite frequently. No I do not run XVM and just play
the vanilla client. It "might" be helpful to look and see what type
of players I am going up against, but I don't trust just stats and
want to play according to what I know about the vehicles I'm going
up against. Just my advice but worry less about the other
teams stats and more about your position, your teammates, and if
you're spotted. "Never fear your enemy but always respect
them." - John Basilone, United States Marine Corps
DeviouslyCursed
Why Does MM Keep Stacking Teams?
27.07.2021 21:29:22
Subject: Why Does MM Keep Stacking Teams?
Link on message: #12885365
umkhulu, on Jul 27 2021 - 19:05, said: If you hadn't got hold of the wrong end of the stick, I
would have to agree with you... Anyway, you are a promising
candidate for the mfezi challenge.... send me the team names (or
preferably IDs) for your last 100 battles. I am pretty confident
that I will be able to guess which teams won for close to 68% of
those 100 battles.....
Link on message: #12885365
umkhulu, on Jul 27 2021 - 19:05, said: If you hadn't got hold of the wrong end of the stick, I
would have to agree with you... Anyway, you are a promising
candidate for the mfezi challenge.... send me the team names (or
preferably IDs) for your last 100 battles. I am pretty confident
that I will be able to guess which teams won for close to 68% of
those 100 battles..... DeviouslyCursed: You say that like it means something. 68%? You should get 50%
with no data at all. No info on map, tier, tanks, players, player
stats, etc.
Einzelganger7
the new max level in crew 2.0 is "88"? like the gang symbol? Really?
27.07.2021 19:47:00
Subject: the new max level in crew 2.0 is "88"? like the gang symbol? Really?
Link on message: #12885297
Suicidal_Enemy, on Jul 27 2021 - 10:41, said: Yes, if you're on the receiving end
of business 
Link on message: #12885297
Suicidal_Enemy, on Jul 27 2021 - 10:41, said: Yes, if you're on the receiving end
of business Einzelganger7:
lol That´s a good point.
lol That´s a good point.
Jaguarz
Developer's Response to Sandbox Surveys
27.07.2021 19:38:39
Subject: Developer's Response to Sandbox Surveys
Link on message: #12885289
Ahrtoo, on Jul 27 2021 - 15:58, said: You are dreaming. Late in the product cycle is the
time when smart product managers harvest whatever money they
can.
Link on message: #12885289
Ahrtoo, on Jul 27 2021 - 15:58, said: You are dreaming. Late in the product cycle is the
time when smart product managers harvest whatever money they
can.Jaguarz: Yeah except that killing a game isnt a harvest. Every example
of core changes in a games later life has been a disaster
regardless of whether the changes have been positive or not and
this game rakes in hundreds of millions still, turning off the
spigot with a shameless cash grab which alters core function isnt a
smart move and there is no precedent that this will work out. Yet
there are multiple examples of this practice failing, even without
a shameless cash grab attached, Star Wars Galaxies being the best
example and this was in an age when online game choices was limited
AND was on arguably the strongest IP globally.
Einzelganger7
the new max level in crew 2.0 is "88"? like the gang symbol? Really?
27.07.2021 19:30:36
Subject: the new max level in crew 2.0 is "88"? like the gang symbol? Really?
Link on message: #12885280
Link on message: #12885280
Einzelganger7: As if a number in a video game would punch people in the face.
There is also an 88mm German gun that can be mounted on tanks like
the Tigers and Panthers, is that offensive as well?
Elias_K_Grodin
Remember that the NA forums are a very small slice of the playerbase
27.07.2021 18:25:41
Subject: Remember that the NA forums are a very small slice of the playerbase
Link on message: #12885235
SociopathicTroll, on Jul 25 2021 - 12:29, said: The NA forums are probably 1% (if that) of the total playerbase.
Most of the players on here tend to be vets of several years,
leaning older in age, and of a certain mentality; that the game was
better in the old days and all of the changes are making it worse.
Many on here act like just because several people on here are
complaining about arty/HE changes and crew 2.0, the entire
playerbase must be doing so in equal fashion. If
you go on reddit for example, you get a much wider and varying
range of opinions.
Link on message: #12885235
SociopathicTroll, on Jul 25 2021 - 12:29, said: The NA forums are probably 1% (if that) of the total playerbase.
Most of the players on here tend to be vets of several years,
leaning older in age, and of a certain mentality; that the game was
better in the old days and all of the changes are making it worse.
Many on here act like just because several people on here are
complaining about arty/HE changes and crew 2.0, the entire
playerbase must be doing so in equal fashion. If
you go on reddit for example, you get a much wider and varying
range of opinions. Elias_K_Grodin: I'm not sure about the exact percentage but the NA Forums
population is more than 1% of the total audience for the NA server
on World of Tanks. Regardless, the voice of the player is
important no matter which platform you discuss WoT related topics.
Whether you love, hate or have suggestions on ideas or concepts
that can improve gameplay or a cool event that you would like to
see, there are moderators and even WoT staff (like myself) that
drop in to see what's the latest/greatest chats that are
happening. "Good ideas are not adopted automatically. They
must be driven into practice with courageous impatience." - Hyman
G. Rickover, United States Navy
Hey_man_Gneis_shot
Remember that the NA forums are a very small slice of the playerbase
27.07.2021 18:25:41
Subject: Remember that the NA forums are a very small slice of the playerbase
Link on message: #12885235
SociopathicTroll, on Jul 25 2021 - 12:29, said: The NA forums are probably 1% (if that) of the total playerbase.
Most of the players on here tend to be vets of several years,
leaning older in age, and of a certain mentality; that the game was
better in the old days and all of the changes are making it worse.
Many on here act like just because several people on here are
complaining about arty/HE changes and crew 2.0, the entire
playerbase must be doing so in equal fashion. If
you go on reddit for example, you get a much wider and varying
range of opinions.
Link on message: #12885235
SociopathicTroll, on Jul 25 2021 - 12:29, said: The NA forums are probably 1% (if that) of the total playerbase.
Most of the players on here tend to be vets of several years,
leaning older in age, and of a certain mentality; that the game was
better in the old days and all of the changes are making it worse.
Many on here act like just because several people on here are
complaining about arty/HE changes and crew 2.0, the entire
playerbase must be doing so in equal fashion. If
you go on reddit for example, you get a much wider and varying
range of opinions. Hey_man_Gneis_shot: I'm not sure about the exact percentage but the NA Forums
population is more than 1% of the total audience for the NA server
on World of Tanks. Regardless, the voice of the player is
important no matter which platform you discuss WoT related topics.
Whether you love, hate or have suggestions on ideas or concepts
that can improve gameplay or a cool event that you would like to
see, there are moderators and even WoT staff (like myself) that
drop in to see what's the latest/greatest chats that are
happening. "Good ideas are not adopted automatically. They
must be driven into practice with courageous impatience." - Hyman
G. Rickover, United States Navy
Jaguarz
Developer's Response to Sandbox Surveys
27.07.2021 17:58:50
Subject: Developer's Response to Sandbox Surveys
Link on message: #12885213
Link on message: #12885213
Jaguarz: I like the "opinions on crew 2.0 are positive because people who
dont like it didnt play it and those who do like it dont say
anything" so basically nothing positive being said = its awesome.
Jaguarz
Developer's Response to Sandbox Surveys
27.07.2021 17:55:18
Subject: Developer's Response to Sandbox Surveys
Link on message: #12885211
ULTRADERECHA, on Jul 27 2021 - 15:33, said: I've always been amazed at the lack of vision of some companies. WG
has one of the biggest games in the world, they could make a ton of
money just by solving the game problems and improving the gameplay
experience. Keeping people happy ensures the longevity of the game.
Why are they reworking low priority stuff and pushing p2w aspects
even further? This whole trend that's been going on for some time
now looks like some executive [edited]move to make quick money or
some higher-up manager/designer trying to climb the ladder as fast
as possible by increasing the revenue of the game no matter the
cost.
Link on message: #12885211
ULTRADERECHA, on Jul 27 2021 - 15:33, said: I've always been amazed at the lack of vision of some companies. WG
has one of the biggest games in the world, they could make a ton of
money just by solving the game problems and improving the gameplay
experience. Keeping people happy ensures the longevity of the game.
Why are they reworking low priority stuff and pushing p2w aspects
even further? This whole trend that's been going on for some time
now looks like some executive [edited]move to make quick money or
some higher-up manager/designer trying to climb the ladder as fast
as possible by increasing the revenue of the game no matter the
cost. Jaguarz: You expect too much and dont realize the structure within.
The development team is relatively small and even the leads are
wage slaves but if they could foist in a monstrous pay to win
scheme that not even EA would attempt they believe they would get
fat bonuses. The drive is personal gain and they will dress it up
as "benefit for the company". I dont believe this will get past the
bean counters because at best its short term gains at the expense
of longevity in an already late middle aged game and the owners of
Wargaming dont need a fast buck and are happy with it printing
money hand over fist year in, year out. That said I dont care
much either way, if crew 2.0 comes I can just find something else
to do with my time.
Jaguarz
Can we please go back to when arty was nerfed...
27.07.2021 16:38:17
Subject: Can we please go back to when arty was nerfed...
Link on message: #12885155
ArmorStorm, on Jul 27 2021 - 14:29, said: Your supposition is hugely false. I know several guys older
and lamer than I, who play mostly arty (because that's all they can
really handle) and who have spend thousands of dollars on this
game. Converted millions of free xp, bought all the premium
tanks, had a premium account from day one and spends hundreds on
Xmas boxes every year. See, the old lame guys have MONEY to
spend on this.
Link on message: #12885155
ArmorStorm, on Jul 27 2021 - 14:29, said: Your supposition is hugely false. I know several guys older
and lamer than I, who play mostly arty (because that's all they can
really handle) and who have spend thousands of dollars on this
game. Converted millions of free xp, bought all the premium
tanks, had a premium account from day one and spends hundreds on
Xmas boxes every year. See, the old lame guys have MONEY to
spend on this.Jaguarz: If all they can really handle is arty why would they spend
money on all the premium tanks? Seems they may want to look into
their psychological well being...
DeviouslyCursed
Is this Really Random?
27.07.2021 07:40:46
Subject: Is this Really Random?
Link on message: #12884992
bake3020, on Jul 27 2021 - 05:00, said: Random is only as random as those that program it and when you a
25% +/- spin to it, it's not random, that's for sure. If you
truly believe it's random then I have some ocean front in crooked
old arizona I will sell you cheap.
Link on message: #12884992
bake3020, on Jul 27 2021 - 05:00, said: Random is only as random as those that program it and when you a
25% +/- spin to it, it's not random, that's for sure. If you
truly believe it's random then I have some ocean front in crooked
old arizona I will sell you cheap.DeviouslyCursed: So when you add Random to Random, it becomes Not
Random. I would hate to possess a mind in which that makes
sense.
Draschel
Red Effect.
27.07.2021 07:34:47
Draschel
Red Effect.
27.07.2021 06:38:42
Subject: Red Effect.
Link on message: #12884961
Link on message: #12884961
Draschel: just some shameless advertising for the guy. Check him
out if you got the time, and if you like tanks I liked tanks
before starting to play WoT, and like them more after. I have
been watching Red Effects content for 3 years now, and each passing
movie learn more about these steel steeds. Educational
indeed. And it is not just tanks either. You'll learn about
top-down attack. Anti tank missiles. Wire guided, radio guided,
beam-riding. Attack helicopters and gunships, fixed wing
attack aircraft. Roles of crew in tanks. Remote weapon
station, automatic loaders, unmanned turrets. CCTV equipment. Day
and night sights and infrared viewer vs thermal intensifiers.
Meteorological sensors. Automatic lead. Tank radar. Digital
displays and battlefield management systems. steering vs
analog control levers. ERA. NERA. Dual and Triple tandem
HEAT. composite armor vs rolled steel. Aramid and
ceramics, depleted uranium. Laser warning receivers, smoke
dischargers, aps systems. apdsfs vs HEAT. 75mm guns to
155mm. The topics he discusses, and in detail, are
lengthy and accurate. from is tank and T54, to T14
armata. M24 chaffee and M47, to bradleys and M1A4. If you like
tanks, drop by for a treat. You won't be disappointed
Draschel
State of the game ♦ 2.0, Field mods, Frontline WG ♦ Doing many changes to fas...
27.07.2021 06:21:20
Subject: State of the game ♦ 2.0, Field mods, Frontline WG ♦ Doing many changes to fas...
Link on message: #12884947
Link on message: #12884947
Draschel: i mean honestly, anyone who knows Tanks history, can recall what
happened to sirfochs and circon, in their missed step
over conduct. And I think they are great players. Isn't about how
great or bad you are when you play. Keep your conduct in check,
when hundreds view you, and you are a CC no less
DomoSapien
Unable to start vehicle Crafting due to non-expired rental in Garage
27.07.2021 05:10:05
Subject: Unable to start vehicle Crafting due to non-expired rental in Garage
Link on message: #12884895
Link on message: #12884895
DomoSapien: Tankers,
I wanted to post a quick update as several players have reached out to inform me they are unable to start crafting one of their desired Premium Tanks via the Clan Wars crafting mechanic.
The vehicle that seems to be affecting most is the WZ-120G-FT. It appears that a multi-battle-long rental was issued at some point as part of a past event or promotion, and the vehicle can't be removed from your garage until a certain number of battles are played in the tank.
You can check out the images below for an idea of what this situation looks like:
There are a couple different solutions to the issue.
The first, and most straightforward: play the remaining x number of battles on your WZ (or other tank) rental. The rental will expire and you will be able to right click > remove in your vehicle carousel to get rid of the tank and clear out the 'vehicle already owned' issue.
The second, less straightforward but potentially more convenient (depending on the number of remaining battles/days in your rental period) would be to submit a ticket to customer support and request the removal of your rental tank.
Click on this link to submit a ticket.
Before anyone asks, I have no idea if there will be any kind of compensation issued, so if you're concerned about earning enough resources to craft a vehicle and need absolutely each day of CW to make sure you earn enough, I recommend choosing a different vehicle to craft, as it may take CS some time to get back to you. I don't anticipate that it'll take them longer than a day to remove your rental but you're big kids and I trust you can make an informed decision. If the ticket queues end up very impacted, response times will likely be impacted as well. Use your best judgment.
I wanted to post a quick update as several players have reached out to inform me they are unable to start crafting one of their desired Premium Tanks via the Clan Wars crafting mechanic.
The vehicle that seems to be affecting most is the WZ-120G-FT. It appears that a multi-battle-long rental was issued at some point as part of a past event or promotion, and the vehicle can't be removed from your garage until a certain number of battles are played in the tank.
You can check out the images below for an idea of what this situation looks like:
There are a couple different solutions to the issue.
The first, and most straightforward: play the remaining x number of battles on your WZ (or other tank) rental. The rental will expire and you will be able to right click > remove in your vehicle carousel to get rid of the tank and clear out the 'vehicle already owned' issue.
The second, less straightforward but potentially more convenient (depending on the number of remaining battles/days in your rental period) would be to submit a ticket to customer support and request the removal of your rental tank.
Click on this link to submit a ticket.
Before anyone asks, I have no idea if there will be any kind of compensation issued, so if you're concerned about earning enough resources to craft a vehicle and need absolutely each day of CW to make sure you earn enough, I recommend choosing a different vehicle to craft, as it may take CS some time to get back to you. I don't anticipate that it'll take them longer than a day to remove your rental but you're big kids and I trust you can make an informed decision. If the ticket queues end up very impacted, response times will likely be impacted as well. Use your best judgment.
DeviouslyCursed
Why do Some Argue Against Skill Based MM?
27.07.2021 04:10:52
Subject: Why do Some Argue Against Skill Based MM?
Link on message: #12884856
Mojo_Riesing, on Jul 26 2021 - 21:47, said: Never mind that most in most iteration of SBMM of any
flavor, what are currently the "bad" players will NEVER see the
"good" players in battle. So simple logic is, if they never meet in
battle, they CAN'T STEAL WINS. I didn't think i'd have to
explain this to you honestly, there doesn't seem to be numbers to
pull up on this one. The bad players don't steal wins from
the good players. The SBMM steals wins from the good players and
and gives them to the bad players. I didn't think I'd have to
explain this to you.
I do get what you are saying but frankly it's not me you need to convince, it may be your fellow players. Appealing to popular opinion is a sure fire way to ruin a game. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: most of the SBMM fans lack the understanding of what it would do to the game, what issues it might fix, and what issues it won't. Currently the heads at WG know, and lets hope it stays that way.
Link on message: #12884856
Mojo_Riesing, on Jul 26 2021 - 21:47, said: Never mind that most in most iteration of SBMM of any
flavor, what are currently the "bad" players will NEVER see the
"good" players in battle. So simple logic is, if they never meet in
battle, they CAN'T STEAL WINS. I didn't think i'd have to
explain this to you honestly, there doesn't seem to be numbers to
pull up on this one. The bad players don't steal wins from
the good players. The SBMM steals wins from the good players and
and gives them to the bad players. I didn't think I'd have to
explain this to you. I do get what you are saying but frankly it's not me you need to convince, it may be your fellow players. Appealing to popular opinion is a sure fire way to ruin a game. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: most of the SBMM fans lack the understanding of what it would do to the game, what issues it might fix, and what issues it won't. Currently the heads at WG know, and lets hope it stays that way.
DeviouslyCursed:
DeviouslyCursed
Your blocked maps? And if you could block 2 more, which would they be.
27.07.2021 03:51:45
Subject: Your blocked maps? And if you could block 2 more, which would they be.
Link on message: #12884845
Link on message: #12884845
DeviouslyCursed: WidePark and Mines I normally don't play under tier 8, but on
the occasion I do, I would always forget to re-block WidePark and
I'd regret it. If I had at least one more option? I'd
block WidePark again, just so I didn't screw up and unblock it by
accident. It's that bad of a map.
DeviouslyCursed
Is it my Imagination?
27.07.2021 03:31:40
Subject: Is it my Imagination?
Link on message: #12884829
Link on message: #12884829
DeviouslyCursed: Yes. Meaning it is just your imagination. I've seen a lot
less arty, btw. Played the other night and couldn't believe how
many arty-less games I had.
Draschel
State of the game ♦ 2.0, Field mods, Frontline WG ♦ Doing many changes to fas...
27.07.2021 03:18:17
Subject: State of the game ♦ 2.0, Field mods, Frontline WG ♦ Doing many changes to fas...
Link on message: #12884818
uberdice, on Jul 26 2021 - 02:24, said: First time watching warp?
Link on message: #12884818
uberdice, on Jul 26 2021 - 02:24, said: First time watching warp?Draschel: second. should be be my last though can't believe
they let CC behave this way my apologies too, I
forgot you. I see you are making content again. Always worth
the time.You and panzerkind should make a push, content wise.
There are alot of gaps, voids that can be filled
Adam_Antium
Pequeño malentendido en Discord
27.07.2021 02:32:55
Subject: Pequeño malentendido en Discord
Link on message: #12884778
Link on message: #12884778
Adam_Antium: Hola, Gaucho. Las reglas de posteo en el canal de
reclutamiento tienen un formato que está marcado en la pequeña
"tachuela" que tienes arriba a la derecha. Allí se especifica la
forma de elaborar posteos y este criterio se establece para, entre
otros motivos, generar una especie de "guía" fácilmente navegable
para jugadores y en los buscadores. Antes de la adición del
formato, ocurría que mucha gente colocaba solicitudes u ofertas sin
dejar datos básicos y buscamos nivelar los posteos en una forma
ordenada. Que cada uno posea un tipo de formato diferente hace que
la navegación se vuelva complicada y nuestro esfuerzo es mantenerlo
"pulcro" y de fácil accesibilidad para todos. De todas formas,
no tenés sanción alguna, seguro fue el bot automatizado. Además, tu
posteo sigue figurando (lo estoy viendo en este mismo momento, fue
posteado 11:05am). Simplemente no cumplía con el diseño que se pide
para mantener la interfaz ordenada. ¡Saludos y cierro el topic
porque el malentendido se ha resuelto! o7
Jaguarz
Just to clarify the question
27.07.2021 02:06:29
Subject: Just to clarify the question
Link on message: #12884753
Link on message: #12884753
Jaguarz: The conversation was within the current wage slave development team
and went like this Dev 1 - "Damn, Im so bummed, we are way
more talented than the hacks who made this game originally yet they
made out like bandits and have daily money fights" Dev 2 -
"IKR, theres just no justice in the world" Dev 3 - "I know,
how about we come up with a shameless cash grab system which would
make EA blush, just imagine if the sheep who play this game all
fork out to keep their crews competitive, the owners would be so
happy they would give us huge bonuses and we can live the high life
too!!!" Devs 1 - "Genius, lets make it happen, the worst that
can happen is the bean counters say no and we continue toiling away
for peanuts but if we keep pushing the garbage onto the players we
may be able to sneak it through then its off to the Mercedes
dealership for everyone!!!" All Devs - "Yay, go team gouge
monkeys!!!!"
DeviouslyCursed
Battle Pass Points Math Error NOT Acknowledged
26.07.2021 22:54:10
Subject: Battle Pass Points Math Error NOT Acknowledged
Link on message: #12884639
mizery, on Jul 25 2021 - 19:51, said: I recently contacted WoT about a problem I observed with the Battle
Pass Game points. See the text of this message below along with
WoT's response. They will not acknowledge the problem, even though
I provided several screenshots showing the math error. This error
only occurs when you limit out a tank, which I have done several
times with my Tier 6 and 7s. I have attached my document with the
screenshots to this message as well. Greetings mizery, Thank
you for contacting Wargaming Player Support. There is no error in
such a situation. In this battle, you reached the limit of points
on the Hummel (Germany) (maximum - 100). That’s why you got only 4
points for the fight, as well as 15 bonus points for reaching the
limit. I hope my explanation will be useful to you. Should you have
any other issues, please don't hesitate to contact us. Best
regards, mizery Created 19 hours ago Battle Pass Points are
not being added correctly when the Points Limit is also added for a
tank. I received 19 points instead of 20 when I limited out my
Hummel and was in the top 10 for a victory. I've noticed this
happening before with other points limits, but have screenshots to
show the incorrect math this time. See the screenshots in the
attached file which document the error. Please look into this, it's
already hard enough to advance through the levels. mizery - NA
Server I wonder how long this post will stay up on the site?
Link on message: #12884639
mizery, on Jul 25 2021 - 19:51, said: I recently contacted WoT about a problem I observed with the Battle
Pass Game points. See the text of this message below along with
WoT's response. They will not acknowledge the problem, even though
I provided several screenshots showing the math error. This error
only occurs when you limit out a tank, which I have done several
times with my Tier 6 and 7s. I have attached my document with the
screenshots to this message as well. Greetings mizery, Thank
you for contacting Wargaming Player Support. There is no error in
such a situation. In this battle, you reached the limit of points
on the Hummel (Germany) (maximum - 100). That’s why you got only 4
points for the fight, as well as 15 bonus points for reaching the
limit. I hope my explanation will be useful to you. Should you have
any other issues, please don't hesitate to contact us. Best
regards, mizery Created 19 hours ago Battle Pass Points are
not being added correctly when the Points Limit is also added for a
tank. I received 19 points instead of 20 when I limited out my
Hummel and was in the top 10 for a victory. I've noticed this
happening before with other points limits, but have screenshots to
show the incorrect math this time. See the screenshots in the
attached file which document the error. Please look into this, it's
already hard enough to advance through the levels. mizery - NA
Server I wonder how long this post will stay up on the site?DeviouslyCursed: User Error. I wonder if YOU will acknowledge it now that
it has been pointed out, or if you will keep trying to blame WG and
make it seem like they are doing something shifty, even though
their response pointed out to you exactly what the issue was.
DeviouslyCursed
Why do Some Argue Against Skill Based MM?
26.07.2021 22:44:54
Subject: Why do Some Argue Against Skill Based MM?
Link on message: #12884633
NeatoMan, on Jul 26 2021 - 18:43, said: I see more and more teams where payers just sit around waiting for
both teams to whittle themselves down, leaving only a few of the
timid players left. Then they go bumbling around the map from
one mistake to another desperately trying to end the match, but
they have no clue how because all they know how to do is sit and
wait. Inevitably they say "good match" when it crawls to a
draw. They view those kinds of games as great because they
think it enables them to showcase their skill.
Fast blowout games don't allow them the opportunity to
showcase their "special" skills, and therefore blowouts must be
stopped. They think SBMM will limit the blowouts, and allow
them to play their own game without the peril of having to
face the better players, who they think will just wipe each
other out, leaving them the opportunity for glory, or at least
leave the good players as one shots to make it easier on
them to show off their true "skillz"
Link on message: #12884633
NeatoMan, on Jul 26 2021 - 18:43, said: I see more and more teams where payers just sit around waiting for
both teams to whittle themselves down, leaving only a few of the
timid players left. Then they go bumbling around the map from
one mistake to another desperately trying to end the match, but
they have no clue how because all they know how to do is sit and
wait. Inevitably they say "good match" when it crawls to a
draw. They view those kinds of games as great because they
think it enables them to showcase their skill.
Fast blowout games don't allow them the opportunity to
showcase their "special" skills, and therefore blowouts must be
stopped. They think SBMM will limit the blowouts, and allow
them to play their own game without the peril of having to
face the better players, who they think will just wipe each
other out, leaving them the opportunity for glory, or at least
leave the good players as one shots to make it easier on
them to show off their true "skillz"DeviouslyCursed: One of the most impressive things you can do it get High
Caliber while winning a blowout match. I got several during 15-1
matches, but still trying to get one during a 15-0. Haven't managed
that yet.
Einzelganger7
August 2021 Preview: Dog (& Cat) Days of Summer
26.07.2021 21:07:53
Subject: August 2021 Preview: Dog (& Cat) Days of Summer
Link on message: #12884567
Link on message: #12884567
Einzelganger7: I like that frontline finally returns but I feel August's schedule
kind of lackluster, it's the month the game celebrates
another year and yet there is nothing about anniversary
celebrations.
Elias_K_Grodin
August 2021 Preview: Dog (& Cat) Days of Summer
26.07.2021 17:24:10
Subject: August 2021 Preview: Dog (& Cat) Days of Summer
Link on message: #12884402
Link on message: #12884402
Elias_K_Grodin: It's the last full month of summer and we've packed the 31 days
with tons of events! In addition to our ongoing Battle Pass, Global
Map, and Referral Program, Frontline returns with a 2021
edition. We've also got some stunning surprises you won't want
to miss! It's also the month of International Cat and Dog Day, and
we've got special customization packages filled with brand-new
feline- and canine-themed Decals and Camouflage (check out "August
Premium Shop & In-Game Offers" for dates)! More details here!
Hey_man_Gneis_shot
August 2021 Preview: Dog (& Cat) Days of Summer
26.07.2021 17:24:10
Subject: August 2021 Preview: Dog (& Cat) Days of Summer
Link on message: #12884402
Link on message: #12884402
Hey_man_Gneis_shot: It's the last full month of summer and we've packed the 31 days
with tons of events! In addition to our ongoing Battle Pass, Global
Map, and Referral Program, Frontline returns with a 2021
edition. We've also got some stunning surprises you won't want
to miss! It's also the month of International Cat and Dog Day, and
we've got special customization packages filled with brand-new
feline- and canine-themed Decals and Camouflage (check out "August
Premium Shop & In-Game Offers" for dates)! More details here!
Elias_K_Grodin
Update 1.14: Tour the Safe Haven Map
26.07.2021 16:58:16
Subject: Update 1.14: Tour the Safe Haven Map
Link on message: #12884379
Link on message: #12884379
Elias_K_Grodin: Commanders! Update 1.14 will introduce the Safe Haven map to
World of Tanks. This location, set in Japan during a period of
immense economic growth, features novelties related both to
gameplay (which may become “double-decked” in one spot) and to
visual design. Let’s take a closer look at Safe
Haven! Get a detailed tour here!
Hey_man_Gneis_shot
Update 1.14: Tour the Safe Haven Map
26.07.2021 16:58:16
Subject: Update 1.14: Tour the Safe Haven Map
Link on message: #12884379
Link on message: #12884379
Hey_man_Gneis_shot: Commanders! Update 1.14 will introduce the Safe Haven map to
World of Tanks. This location, set in Japan during a period of
immense economic growth, features novelties related both to
gameplay (which may become “double-decked” in one spot) and to
visual design. Let’s take a closer look at Safe
Haven! Get a detailed tour here!
Draschel
Spending earned tokens.
26.07.2021 06:30:38
Subject: Spending earned tokens.
Link on message: #12884235
Link on message: #12884235
Draschel: interesting i can still earn these tokens.But i cannot spend them.
Rather odd.
Jaguarz
Possible Reason Behind Crew 2.0?
26.07.2021 04:53:13
Subject: Possible Reason Behind Crew 2.0?
Link on message: #12884198
Link on message: #12884198
Jaguarz: Its not rocket science, the reason for crew 2.0 is the current wage
slave development team, deeply jealous of the original crew who
made off like bandits with sacks of cash, want a fat payday and
think this blatant pay to win scheme will net them that.
Jaguarz
Selling 60-70-80 Point Commanders is the Reason for Crew 2.0
26.07.2021 04:05:52
Subject: Selling 60-70-80 Point Commanders is the Reason for Crew 2.0
Link on message: #12884167
I_QQ_4_U, on Jul 25 2021 - 20:11, said: It's less complex and if for some bizarre reason if I
wanted to convert all my 250+ crews in one sitting I could probably
do it in 2 or 3 hours. Of course nobody would ever do that because
they are not going to play hundreds of tanks all at the same time
and likely many of them they hardly play.
Link on message: #12884167
I_QQ_4_U, on Jul 25 2021 - 20:11, said: It's less complex and if for some bizarre reason if I
wanted to convert all my 250+ crews in one sitting I could probably
do it in 2 or 3 hours. Of course nobody would ever do that because
they are not going to play hundreds of tanks all at the same time
and likely many of them they hardly play.Jaguarz: You know precisely what choices and builds you want for all
those tanks and are all lined up ready to go then? Amazing, because
if there is real choice and the options open real variety then you
should surely have to work out whats best for which tank in which
situation, along with the worry and fear that you will make the
wrong choice and have to spend money to respec it, unless of course
there is a cookie cutter build ready to go and then whats the point
of this anyway? How exactly is it "less complex" than picking the
basic crew skills as it stands now exactly? So either there is
a huge variety of options on the table for variation and it gets
complex with how things stack up and interact with each other or
its simple and theres no point to it at all.
Draschel
Spending earned tokens.
26.07.2021 04:04:57
Subject: Spending earned tokens.
Link on message: #12884165
PapioTitan, on Jul 26 2021 - 01:52, said: It was a parachute under Depot I believe. Mines gone and I never
got to cash in. No warning. Oh well....
Link on message: #12884165
PapioTitan, on Jul 26 2021 - 01:52, said: It was a parachute under Depot I believe. Mines gone and I never
got to cash in. No warning. Oh well....Draschel: I hear you. Tough. I have have been wrong, and the date was July 24
not 26thI spent 65 tokens, but had probably 15 more. Could have got
more stuff.Poor warnings, of course. Not really the best for those
leading day jobs
Draschel
Spending earned tokens.
26.07.2021 03:28:02
Subject: Spending earned tokens.
Link on message: #12884139
Link on message: #12884139
Draschel: I had a popup come up in main tanks garage, spending tokens, which
i swore were expiring before the campaign starts. And have earned a
bit more, and want to redeem the rest.These aren't battle pass
tokens, not those. I see those. These are the tokens for exterior
paint, the 1st Tank Guard, German Assault, Ice Shelf, the weird
redeemable single crew member, outer decals, 3x garage slots, 10x
large repairs/large first aid bundles. Shell tokens, I guess?I
cannot seem to find where this window is. Been to the store,
depot, missions, exterior, Etc. As i said earlier, a garage popup
brought me there a couple days back. Thanks in
advance,
Draschel
HE changes have RUINED Derp Guns
26.07.2021 01:33:43
Subject: HE changes have RUINED Derp Guns
Link on message: #12884083
Casual_Boops, on Jul 25 2021 - 19:20, said: I don't think anyone is saying that the KV-2 can't pen
things, because it could do that before and it can still do that,
but the main difference is that when you aren't able to pen things
(because you're a slow, lumbering heavy tank with one of the least
accurate guns in the game) you now do very little damage. That's
the point. Showing your one game where you penned things and saying
"see, it's fine" is glossing over the main points of the
conversation.
Link on message: #12884083
Casual_Boops, on Jul 25 2021 - 19:20, said: I don't think anyone is saying that the KV-2 can't pen
things, because it could do that before and it can still do that,
but the main difference is that when you aren't able to pen things
(because you're a slow, lumbering heavy tank with one of the least
accurate guns in the game) you now do very little damage. That's
the point. Showing your one game where you penned things and saying
"see, it's fine" is glossing over the main points of the
conversation.Draschel: but KV2 and OI still average DPG more or less fine by tier.
What is the problem? It isn't one example of a good game, or
glossing over anything.
Draschel
Cliff.
25.07.2021 23:28:34
Subject: Cliff.
Link on message: #12884024
Link on message: #12884024
Draschel: Hey all, happy sunday. Just looking for some opinions about
Cliff, at a competitive level Tier 8 and 10 of course. This
led to some inter-clan dispute the other day, about what exactly is
to be done on Cliff. I was under the impression, that a light
tank tries its best to secure hill itself, or doing its best to
deny it from the enemies light tank. Whether EBR105 or T100LT,
EBR75 or LT432. Then gun depression mediums, fast heavies do their
best to get to base of lighthouse ridgeline, STB1 / Chieftain /
Kran Etc or Caernarvon/Renegade/progetto/LIS. E5-E6,
F5-F6 respectively. With the initial fight for map control and view
range, high ground, the goal would be to trap enemy tanks C5-D5 and
G5-H5 in their climb to the middle, making them stop and incredibly
vulnerable and bunched up. THEN, and WHEN this is
achieved, flanks, wingmen, fliers can be used for crossfire donut,
F3/D3 or to spot arty, Etc. Like a progetto or bourrat, 907s/140s.
Non gun depression core wolf-pack heavy tanks, like 277 and
260, 53TP bunch up at the base of ridge either end, to cause
a dead zone crossing D4 and F4, preventing enemy reinforcing donut.
Maybe, and a slim maybe, a Strv at perches, or uniquely J3 because
north span doesn't have an elevated spot like that. Generally,
narrow 2 line and 9 line, are of very limited focus and provide
very little map control, vision.... leading to your team
wasting its resources, time, spreading thin, or worse boxing itself
up. So the clan gets caught up in dispute, over the dumb
2 line. In my experience in advances, listening to people like
ophacker, supernova, zero I have very few times, seen a dedicated
effort to take donut by brute force, 1-2. Maybe in 8s, where a
fast-boi is anticipated. Who does something like this, yet it
"seemed" like the entire clan holds that as the big play.
Wth? I am pretty new here, 4months and wasn't around for the
last campaign, but Jeez. I also took a look at FAME CLIFF strats,
and other than exotic 1-2 pushes using 268 V 4, which I am sure
they used because of some sort of prior intel gathering or wanting
to try some s--- push, majority of the strat still seems focus on
E5-E6 / F5-F6 play with gun dep tanks such as chieftain/STB1/Kran,
holding up the enemy and trapping them in a s------- C5/G5,
pincer heavy tanks like 260/277 E4 and THEN using donut
for crossfire or spotting SPG. Light to secure or deny hill.
Wth 2 Line? Most I saw were 140s/907s using it as flex, after map
control mid is established. I took a quick look at WoT GURU
too, and the "light" strat for most to see and follow, seem to
densely focus on lighthouse too, rather than 1-2 +
donut Educated, experienced thoughts? I mean its a top 40
clan. This is nonsense.
Draschel
The GSOR 1008 Is ...
25.07.2021 22:34:56
Subject: The GSOR 1008 Is ...
Link on message: #12883990
Link on message: #12883990
Draschel: Are you going to argue with Gang_starr, the same way? And make fun
of his account too? That was yesterday. People are telling you
the same thing, and you blindly dodge the numbers. 0.29/0.29 are
horrendous tier VI gun stats. Nevermind tier VIIIIt has massively
more horsepower available, better reverse speed, traverse rates
both vehicular and turret. and an edge view range. The movement
camo aren't too far apart (not even 1.00 base) and stationary
camo won't matter because you are using bushes anyway. 320mm APCR
dropping 400-500m to 220mm is laughable, don't you even look at the
figures? They are there to see. 263mm dropping to 253, is
inconsequential and excellent drop off. Lorraine has 150 more DPM,
thats like 1/2 shot more per min Hold your horses. I am not
saying GSOR is better, or Lorraine is better. If I had to choose
which I'd rather buy with a 30% coupon, it would be GSOR because I
like TD and I need a brit TD trainer. This is not about that, or
about who is using them. This is about you being wrong in
obnoxiously saying GSOR does everything better. Which it clearly
don't
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