Sandbox 2021: Try Out Crew 2.0!
Дата: 25.02.2021 12:47:17
Ragnaguard, on 25 February 2021 - 02:56 AM, said: and how Wg will profit from this? u left the MOST IMPORTANT factor
out of the equation.... go think better plz and return with an
option that profits WG... then they might consider it 02:59 Added
after 2 minute name ONE sandbox tested change that did not reach
the live! even rubicon mega fail is returning ... only difference
is instead of milking the cammo they do it with something that will
affect EVERYBODY! the crew..... plz name ONE change that was
not implemented prove me an idiot! 03:02 Added after 5 minute
ahhahahahhahahahahah my eye fell on the -30% which is 17
million exp! means the crew get alzheimers and forgets to even
walk!!!!!!! ahahahahhahahahahahahha laughed like crazy on
this! go on do the credits one and loose almost 7 mil
exp!!!!!! ahahaha alll these hours playing for this!!!
ahahhahahahahh eeepppiiiiiccccccc.HeatResistantBFG: name ONE sandbox tested change that did not reach the live! even
rubicon mega fail is returning ... only difference is instead of
milking the cammo they do it with something that will affect
EVERYBODY! the crew..... plz name ONE change that was not
implemented prove me an idiot! 03:02 Added after 5 minute
ahhahahahhahahahahah my eye fell on the -30% which is 17
million exp! means the crew get alzheimers and forgets to even
walk!!!!!!! ahahahahhahahahahahahha laughed like crazy on
this! go on do the credits one and loose almost 7 mil
exp!!!!!! ahahaha alll these hours playing for this!!!
ahahhahahahahh eeepppiiiiiccccccc. Ammo Rework, Health Rework
(to work with Ammo Rework), Changes to Pen Drop over Distance and
Changes to the overmatch mechanic (IIRC this one made it all the
way to CT), That's 4 (and you could argue ammo is more than 1 as it
went through multiple iterations and versions IIRC) that didn't
make it to live. It's well known that things going to sandbox do
not mean they will enter the game.
Fozzy50, on 25 February 2021 - 03:14 AM, said: I completely agree with you, your full post. Be careful when
you write 'I expect crew 2.0 to go live as is' ; WG read 'I want
crew 2.0 to go live as is'. 
HeatResistantBFG: As much as I'm sure our lives would be easier if we did that
We really don't. The point of the
Sandbox is a test of concept and not a test of
"execution/implementation", Example would be "do players dislike a
change to Aspect X, or do they dislike THE change to aspect X?". So
I would want more context, and from reading their comment I would
take it as they don't like the concept 
We really don't. The point of the
Sandbox is a test of concept and not a test of
"execution/implementation", Example would be "do players dislike a
change to Aspect X, or do they dislike THE change to aspect X?". So
I would want more context, and from reading their comment I would
take it as they don't like the concept FinnHit, on 25 February 2021 - 04:17 AM, said: This whole system seems like WG's desperate efforts to drill with
massive double barrels into players' Uranus in hopes to find more
gold there. And then we have these heroes trying to explain
how everything is sunshine and rainbows with the new system:
You do understand that 0-skill basically doubles the
experience you have grinded so far with the crew member? The free
first skill(s) for 0-skill crews is kind of misconception,
because it's actually the last skill(s) that you get for free - you
grind for the first ones that has low experience requirements and
on top of those you get one or two skills for free. And because
every additional skill requires a bit more experience than all the
previous skills combined, the absolute experience bonus of every
0-skill gets massive the more skills you have. So if you have
example Santa with two 0-skills, skillwise that equals roughly
normal crew member of 4 times the experience. To make this
into rough formula Grinded crew experience * 2(amount of
0-skills) = Experience required for normal crew member with the
same amount of skills Thus one 0-skill crew member:
Grinded crew experience * 2 = Normal crew member would need double
the grind to have same skills And two 0-skill crew member
(like Santa): Grinded crew experience * 4 = Normal crew
member would need four times the grind to have same skills
Now you see how massive the bonus is for these 0-skill crews for
grinded experience? This is why people have spent real money buying
the Rudys, Thunderbolts, Tiger 131 etc. to basically halve the
needed grind for the current skills for these crew members. In Crew
2.0 all of these crew members are translated into commanders taking
into account only the base grinded experience, plus additional 3rd
or 2nd grade instructors giving some random minor skill boost +
crew training bonus. This does not get even close to what the
special crews are in current system and everyone who have these
special crews from events, missions or bought with premium tanks
has legit right to be upset for what these crew members are
converted in crew 2.0. People have already explained pretty
much everything related to the pros and cons of the crew 2.0 in
this thread, and there's some really good posts all over here. But
just to summarize what I think about this system so far: The
basic ideas in this system is great: The crew mismatches
when grinding the trees are gone when representing the crew with
single commander. No more 50% or 75% crews. 6th sense as default
skill. Training curve flattened, so that the later skills are
actually achievable. Crew can be used in multiple tanks. But
as with example team clash, WG has amazing ability to turn great
ideas into garbage with full of holes with their bad designing and
implementation. The major concerns for me: 0-skill
crews are totally screwed and lots of people have bought these
crews for real money. People having lots of tanks with their own
crews are getting shafted compared to people who have concentrated
into few crews. Consolidating the crews is the way to go in crew
2.0, but by doing so people with own crews for every tanks loses
2/3 ~ 1/2 of all the time & money put into these now useless crews.
Tool to turn these extra crew members into experience (like crew
books) you can then use to boost the remaining crews is needed.
WG please, start hiring smarter people to avoid these
disasters.HeatResistantBFG: I think you have misunderstood what 0 point perks are, the
way they work is that they don't increase the XP requirements for
subsequent skills. But even if they did, that wouldn't change the
XP calculation currently being used, it isn't taking 1 skill = X, 2
skill = 2X, 3 skill = 6X or something like that, it used the
amount of XP earnt... So even if it had worked as you said you
would still keep the XP earnt exactly the same. But currently, the
reason o point perks aren't included is exactly the opposite of
what you're saying, they don't contribute to the XP earnt on your
crew in any way and so it isn't counted when converted and so when
the XP earnt on the crew is added together and then averaged they
aren't adding to that total. People their concerns with
the 0 point crew conversion is the best way to have how it happens
changed for future iterations though, so make sure to play the
sandbox and then if you get a survey include it in any feedback.
That way you are not only heard "once" here but also a second time
there
Ragemane, on 25 February 2021 - 04:50 AM, said: Question for WG Staff:I couldn't handle all the 49 pages, so sorry if you have given an answer already!
Is there any chance to see which skills/perks an instructor will boost BEFORE we select anything? eg. I want to have +2 Concealment, so I chose Technical Training but I only got Pain Threshold and Firefighting - Technically this instructor is now wasted and is bound to these skills....
I mean otherwise it is some sort of RNG-fest and you would have wasted a valuable resource (aka instructor) for nothing... Another negative point: The "4-Tanker Crew" (Rudy) will be automatically converted with 4 fixed instructors who cant be removed/replaced AND have fixed skills/perks which are not optimal at all or what I want.... I've paid real money for this crew..... from my subjective point of view this is a big middle finger to everyone who spent money and bought Rudys to get valuable 0 perk crews... (beside the "spent money" argument... as the skills/perks are very crapy.... my 0 perk crew got from "best crew because I get one perk for free" to "worst crew because I've lost 1 skill/perk during the conversion as 0 perk skills are not contributing towards the xp conversion (because 0 perk = 0 xp) and compared to an old non-0 perk crew I cant even use instructors with skills/perks I want"... this is even a bigger middle finger... )
HeatResistantBFG: So currently you get the choice of the 3 options, but you
can't be certain to get perk X no. But it is subject to
change, this is just a test of concept and if people don't like the
execution we will change it try and find something our players
like, and if they don't like the concept then it will likely be
scrapped (as previous ones I mentioned in my first reply
did). To the second part, I would reiterate it is all subject
to change, currently, that is how it was implemented but isn't
guaranteed to stay that way. Letting us know here and again in any
survey you get from the sandbox is the best way to make your
feedback heard
trispect, on 25 February 2021 - 07:15 AM, said: So when I converted my AMX 30 crew which is at 78% sixth skill I
got level 65 commander and when I converted my Batchat crew which
is at 98% on fifth skill I got level 72% commander. That's messed
up.HeatResistantBFG: The way the new crew is created is based on the XP earnt on
the crew, if you have any 0 point skills on the first crew that
would explain it.
aleksije89, on 25 February 2021 - 07:32 AM, said: well, you get less bang for your buck. Old 5 skill crew can get
everything, +7% view range from Situational awareness and Recon,
+100% repair and camo, firefighting, Snapshot, and Smooth ride,
BIA, Safe Stowage, intuition, preventive maintenance,
everything.In the new system you'll get +4% view range from "eyes open", +5% handling from "cohesion" (BIA equivalent), +80% repair and camo, Smooth turret traverse, smooth handling, firefighting and you are left with 5 more skill points...
It would take about 90 points to get the same performance from your tank.
I like the situational skills and instructor system, but the skill system overall is a nerf...
Also they need to allow us to do something with the unused crew. in the Q&A stream Eekaboo and Luca said that nothing will be done about it. Special crew was introduced back in 2016 if I remember correctly, and old players worked hard and participated in events to get 0 skill BIA crew and replace old 2-3-4 skill crews. I have over 130 "instructors", hence 130 crews that are just waiting in the barracks. Make a system to recycle them in some way, not doing anything about it is the wrong way to go. I know that giving hundreds of books might be OP, but at least you can allow players to put more crew members of the same tank when converting. (p.e. both of my 3 skill crews for Leopard 1 to get a 5 skill crew).
I welcomed all changes and they turned out fine, but this is the first time I'm thinking of uninstalling if the system I saw on sandbox goes live... If you're going to nerf what we can get from skills and leave me with the 130 crew (and their XP) in the barracks, I would feel abandoned. The whole stream they were talking about "new players", I guess you don't need the people that played the game and supported you for years.
HeatResistantBFG: With instructors, you can get more than that 4% and then on
top of that the new "crew skill" level you can currently get with a
maxed out crew is around 141% before situational perks which can
add around another 20% to the crew and at least 3% directly to
the view range. So if you dig deeper you can actually go above the
current levels on any single aspect, but it would be harder to buff
across the "whole" as it would before. To say the overall change is
a nerf is factually inaccurate though, you have to specialise more
than before and the result is certain aspects get buffed a LOT more
than before in some cases. I did a comparison of a max perk crew
and max lvl on the new system and the new crew was better by some
way in most areas without even taking into account the situational
boosts. "All crew members in the Barracks who do not have
enough experience to train at least one skill will no longer occupy
bunks in the Barracks. They will be automatically converted to Crew
Books of the corresponding nation, which can then be used to
improve new crews." This is from our main article, so any of
the 100% crews you have lying around will be turned into books
All of this is subject
to change though, this is the current implementation and the entire
idea of the sandbox is to see what our players think, like and
dislike about the more drastic/large scale changes. So there is
still plenty of time to influence how or even IF this comes to the
game.
All of this is subject
to change though, this is the current implementation and the entire
idea of the sandbox is to see what our players think, like and
dislike about the more drastic/large scale changes. So there is
still plenty of time to influence how or even IF this comes to the
game. EImo, on 25 February 2021 - 07:39 AM, said: The agenda behind this change is that they want it to be christmas
all year around. The instructor randomness is in place so they can
start selling packs containing instructors and then you gamble to
get 1st class instructors with right skills (aka fifa player
decks). They smell money and are not backing down.HeatResistantBFG: Considering it isn't final, and is not even remotely like
you're describing kinda takes away your point. Is it completely
random? No, you can choose the category and then there are 3
choices. Is this system going to he the final system? No
necessarily. Is it even remotely like Fifa packs.. not in the
slightest Could it be better? For sure! And
that's the aim of the sandbox
Could it be better? For sure! And
that's the aim of the sandbox Sturmi_0545, on 25 February 2021 - 07:54 AM, said: is it only me, or did they remove direct access to this thread from
the portal ("discuss" button)? advice: if you wrote pages of
feedback - and there is some good stuff in this thread -, save it
somewhere in a word file on your pc. WG might moderate things to
the ground to get their "70% approval rating".HeatResistantBFG:
trololooooooo, on 25 February 2021 - 07:59 AM, said: Discuss button still works for me.HeatResistantBFG: Nope, as said here it still works and is there Also, the idea that we are
removing posts that say negative feedback is kinda
laughable 
. Have you been through this
thread?
Also, the idea that we are
removing posts that say negative feedback is kinda
laughable . Have you been through this
thread? Trostani, on 25 February 2021 - 08:32 AM, said: What is most funny - this new system will screw new players a lot.
Sealclubers will be able to make 1-3 broken crews and banging
new players without asking for their names. And do you know how
many battles in one tank new player will need to reach 75 points
commander? Of course new player will be able to pay hundreds of €
for each commander to catch up and this is main reason for those
changes.HeatResistantBFG: I tried converting a relatively new crew (1 perk
trained, 60% or so training) and the crew was actually much better
on the Sandbox than the Live, so there is actually some nice
bonuses to new players thanks to the more gradual skill gain rather
than nothing for X games and then suddenly a boost, then nothing
for 2X games then boost etc.
And people can boost commanders no differently than now, so not sure how suddenly that's a reason for these changes... In terms of people who like to play low tiers, they would have good crews at these tiers anyhow, so now they may also play the higher tiers with the same crew and spend less time at low tier so it seems unlikely they would suddenly play even more low tiers or with stronger crews.
And people can boost commanders no differently than now, so not sure how suddenly that's a reason for these changes... In terms of people who like to play low tiers, they would have good crews at these tiers anyhow, so now they may also play the higher tiers with the same crew and spend less time at low tier so it seems unlikely they would suddenly play even more low tiers or with stronger crews.
Sandbox 2021: Try Out Crew 2.0!